Our guest today is Chris Jordan, founder of the Oikos Food Buyers Club in Fort Myers, Florida. He's passionate about self-sustainability, individual freedom, and making a good life where you're at.
Below you’ll find an (edited) transcript of this episode, with takeaways for each section of our conversation.
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Books & Resources Mentioned In This Episode:
RESOURCES
BOOKS
- Shrinking the Integrity Gap
- 4-Hour Workweek
- Productivity is for Robots
- E-Myth by Michael Gerber
- Brave New World
Why food?
Timestamp: 00:40
CHRIS:
My family and I have always been passionate about clean, healthy, local food. Within our first year of marriage, I was dealing with some gut issues: I was in the military at the time, probably not getting the best food. And I asked my wife if she could help me figure this out. And so my wife, being the good researcher that she is, started learning about glyphosate ruining the gut microbiome and the GMO foods poisoned glyphosate, how eating locally and organically was better for seasonal allergies and she just kind of started going down the rabbit hole.
Fast forward 10 years and now we're that family with four kids in tow trying to go to four or five different places to get our raw dairy, our grass-fed beef, our pastured poultry, our free range eggs…
Good food is critical. It's foundational to health, and I just love good food. 
So that was really the catalyst for starting the club.
We kind of always had this problem because it’s challenging to go to all these places especially for a homeschooling mom with kids in tow… and then Covid happens and it turns out our really efficient food chain is actually really fragile and so it's like what do we do if this happens again?
We need a more local resilient food system that's not so dependent on trucks and airplanes and freighters.
When was the point where you stopped thinking about doing something and decided to start?
Timestamp: 02:55
CHRIS:
I was really dissatisfied with the desk job that I was working.
I was super bored. I'm not meant to be behind a computer all day in my khaki pants and button-down shirt. It's just not me.
I was doing it for a season: it was clear that's where the Lord put us and put me for a season.
But I was bored to tears!
I had always felt like an entrepreneur. I've done a lot of entrepreneurial things. My wife and I were missionaries and raised our own support, and kind of even as a kid I played around with little small businesses, so I always had an entrepreneurial spirit and bent and yeah, I think it was just kind of that boredom and Lord, give me something different. I want to do my own thing. I want to be an entrepreneur.
The opportunity presented itself to start Oikos through some like-minded Christian businessmen who were able to provide some much needed capital to get started because they had the same vision.
So it felt very serendipitous and ordained. It was a leap of faith and we decided to do it.
ABIGAIL:
So, you had kind of two different things going on at the same time. You had a passion for healthy food. You also had a desire to do something on your own. And so when those two things crossed paths, you were like, "This is the perfect opportunity to make the most of both of them.”
CHRIS:
Instead of two things, it was three or four things that were all intersecting.
I learned this phrase several years ago and I can't remember where, but it’s this idea of integrity gaps.
An integrity gap is that; I want my life to be a certain way, but how I currently am is very different, and there's a gap there.
And so my integrity gap was that I wanted to be at home with my family and I don't want to be commuting and working a job that's separate from them. I want something different. And then I also don't want a job that's primarily behind the computer. I want to be working with animals. I want to be working with plants. It's very therapeutic for me. So adding those two into the equation, it all intersected onto this agri-business model.
ABIGAIL:
So, it's more serendipitous than “I decided I was going to start a food buyers club.” Things just fall together when they fall together, and then you take the opportunity or you don't.
Takeaway
1. Discover who you are.
- What are my strengths?
- What are my talents?
- What milestones have I experienced in my life that point to how God has gifted me?
RESOURCES:
2. Determine what kind of lifestyle you want.
- How do you want to spend your time? How do you want your daily activities to feel?
- Who do you want to spend most of your time with? How do you want your interactions to feel?
- Where do you want to live and work the majority of your life? How do you want your environment to feel?
- Who do you want to be when you grow up? How do you want to feel in your physical body, your emotions, your mind, and your spirit?
- What do you want to be surrounded by? How do you want to feel about the things you own and use regularly?
RESOURCES:
- The Corporate Growth Trap—And How to Opt Out
- What If Slowing Down Is the Most Productive Thing You Can Do?
- Is Living Like a King Really the American Dream? Rethinking Our Definition of Success
3. Identify integrity gaps.
- Take a good hard look at your current life and compare it to the ideal lifestyle you designed.
- What will you have to change to bring it more in line with what you want?
- How could you go about changing those things?
When you were getting started, did you feel like you had to make things happen? How did it come together?
Timestamp: 08:19
ABIGAIL:
I feel like a lot of people white-knuckle it, like they're trying to make it grow faster and faster, but trees grow the speed they're going to grow and you can't make them grow any faster. So, what did that beginning process look like for you?
CHRIS:
Yeah, I love the analogy of the tree and of your platform, Avocado Entrepreneur. So, there was some white knuckling up front… not so much to get the tree to grow, more like preparing the soil for the tree.
To continue this metaphor: So, there was some infrastructure that needed to happen. When this opportunity presented itself, my family was out here with our RV site, our temporary power pole, our little pump house, and then a 10x20 shed that was like the kitchen, laundry room, and tool room all in one. And there was no other real infrastructure.
So I presented this to the board – these Christian businessmen that I talked about – and said “hey X Y and Z needs to happen and it's going to take me four to six months.” And we discussed it, and they were cool with it and then it was a kind of go time.
They said “Yeah, we can fund you for a little while; can you get it done in this time frame?" and I said yes.
So I had to finish the driveway, I had to bring electricity over to the barn; so it was a lot of long days. But it was also really fun.
There was all the excitement at first. Some adrenaline too. 
It was cool to see our property come together too, because this is like now I'm getting paid for my time and I can do some of these farm projects that needed to happen anyway but they're going to serve this business.
So yeah, there was a grind at first for sure.
ABIGAIL:
I like that you were preparing the soil. There are things that you just have to have in place to get started.
No matter what you're starting, there is always some preliminary infrastructure that you have to push to get started.
But I think it’s important that you weren't expecting it to just blow up overnight, like go viral or whatever. You knew this was going to be a long haul.
CHRIS:
Oh yeah, there was still a lot of work to do for the tree.
When you've got that five gallon tree in the ground, it still needs a little bamboo stake to help it grow straight and you’ve got to come out there and adjust the ties and check on it. It's really fragile there with the sun: it just got put in the ground.
There's some transplant shock, for sure
So, there is some babying that still happens once it's in the ground.
Takeaway
- Getting something started will take work, and it may even be long hours at first. But you shouldn’t need to “make it happen” or white-knuckle anything.
If your business was a tree, what kind of tree would it be?
Timestamp: 13:37
CHRIS:
I actually took your Growth Chart Quiz and I was a Sprout.
But yeah, I think I would be a mango tree because it's really sweet and has delicious fruit, but sometimes it gives me a poisonous itchy rash…
I love mangoes. They're beautiful trees. They're low maintenance, they thrive in our climate, and I can eat them, but I can't pick them without being super careful because the sap just lights me up and I get a very itchy rash.
There are times where the business burns me. Maybe I'm pushing a little bit too hard… humans are always struggling to find center. So those itchy rash times are my indicator that I need to come back to center.
ABIGAIL:
Mango trees grow to a certain size and then they more or less maintain that size. They may grow a little bit over the years, but they're not going to get 500 feet tall. There's a point where the growth levels out and you can't really expect much more.
So with your business being a food buyers club and it being very holistic and community focused, how big do you think your business realistically will get? What is the size of a “food buyers club” tree and how big do you want it to get?
CHRIS:
There's only so big that Oikos Food Buyers Club can get, since our focus is on local food.
There's only so big that I even want to get.
I think that's hard, too, because we've all grown up in America, and capitalism, any other system, has its strengths and has its weaknesses.
And one of the weaknesses is this idea of unlimited growth and GDP always has to go up. But we're all dealing with scarce finite resources and nothing in nature grows infinitely.
It has cycles.
So yeah, I only want it to get so big so long as it suits my purposes of providing for my needs.
I don't want to have to get another job, I want it to make enough that I can just work and I can stay at home and be with my kids, and I have the freedom to take off on a Wednesday or whatever.
ABIGAIL:
So, you're wanting it to be something that sustains you but also leaves you with that time autonomy to be able to choose what you do when you do it.
CHRIS:
I mean, you have to take that with a grain of salt because it's kind of like the double-edged sword: there are times I can take off on a Tuesday, Wednesday – I don't have to ask for PTO or any of that – but then there's also times where the freezer goes down at 11:00 at night and I've got to be out there till 2am fixing it because I've got $10,000 worth of beef in the freezer and I can't just eat that cost.
ABIGAIL:
So sometimes the business has demands on your time, but you don't have to answer to anybody else telling you when to be places, which is an important distinction for people like us who don't like being told what to do. 
CHRIS:
Yes, exactly.
Takeaway
- Nothing in nature grows indefinitely. A true cottage-industry business is just big enough to achieve your goals for time and financial autonomy, without the pressure of endless growth for growth’s sake.
So when you were starting, what did you focus on first to get it going?
Timestamp: 20:22
CHRIS:
Once we launched it was mostly word of mouth. I did a lot of speaking engagements at local communities.
I did get on Facebook and ask to join “Mindful Mamas of Southwest Florida” and groups that obviously pertain to my target demographic and then when people would ask about “where are you getting raw milk” or “what are you paying for ground beef” or “I'm looking for beef shares” I would just chime in.
I wasn't spamming these groups, but I monitored them every day, and sure enough people were looking for this type of food.
That got us a lot of traffic. That was really good for our business. I don't do it as much now. I think I've got enough members and enough people out there that every now and then I'll get on and check and if there's a thread someone will at least mention us, and tag us in it.
ABIGAIL:
Kind of the tipping point where they now do your word of mouth marketing for you.
CHRIS:
Yeah, and then the third thing was I started a referral program. I think one of them is up to $150-160 in referrals now.
Takeaway
- Find groups online or in person that contain your target demographic. Interact with them in a polite and friendly way.
- Start a referral program so your biggest fans can become your marketers through word of mouth.
Would you do anything differently about how you started?
Timestamp: 23:43
CHRIS:
I would have bit the bullet up front and paid for the nice software. I went cheap and used a barebones software designed for farmers to sell their stuff online, it was $20 a month, and then I had to upgrade to the nicer software which is costing me $250 a month.
But I'm so glad that I did.
My website looks more professional. It handles all my logistics for me, from accounting, to print outs of packing lists and invoicing, to multiple pickup locations and times, and automated emails.
ABIGAIL:
But you didn't know what you needed until you felt those pinch points. So maybe, having that sooner would have helped, but doing it the hard way meant that you knew what you really needed and what you didn't.
Takeaway
- Getting the best systems in place can save you a lot of headaches down the road, but sometimes you have to figure out what you really need the hard way.
How do you make sure that this business is not taking over your life?
Timestamp: 27:44
ABIGAIL:
I use the term “sustainability” which I know in business these days has more to do with using glass instead of plastic and carbon footprints and stuff, but I use that term to mean “can you sustain working on this long term.”
So how do you make sure that you're building that buffer into what you do?
CHRIS:
I think that’s one of the best questions you can ask yourself, because yeah, it is all consuming and you hear the adage of “the best thing about being an entrepreneur is that you get to decide what 80 hours a week you want to work.”
And you hear about a minimum of 60 hour work weeks and “hey to be an entrepreneur you're going to grind” and you're going to grind for a few years and then you're hoping for some big payout. That's the traditional path.
So, for me, my first line of defense is just that I have a wife and kids. My kids come knocking at 5-5:30. “Daddy, when are you going to be done?” So that helps.
There's lots of good tools out there for organizing your time, being efficient with your time.
The 4-Hour Workweek by Tim Ferriss is a good starting point. There's all these productivity books that are good. I also use the Eisenhower priority matrix.
But this thing about self-development is that it's kind of like this self-licking ice cream cone.
It's like it never stops.
At some point you have to realize: productivity is for robots.
I used to drive really hard and be super efficient and productive, and efficiency was one of my highest values. And that's the society that we've been raised in, especially as an East Coast kid.
But man, I really resonate with the title of that book. I'm just like, "Yeah, I'm not a robot. I'm a human and I want time for human things." So that means I want to get outside in the garden. I don’t want to delegate all the farm chores to the kids. No, I want a farm chore because I like being out on the farm and I like being with them when they're doing their chores.
So I guess the way that I try to do it is I just realize that I can't do it all.
I don't white knuckle trying to grow, I let it grow organically. I'm only going to have a short window of time with my kids.
When they say my eulogy for my funeral, I don't really care if people say "And he ran Oikos so well and it was so profitable." I hope my wife and my kids get up there and be like, " Dad poured into us. He discipled us."
Those are the kind of things that I want people to say about me, not what kind of a business owner I was.
ABIGAIL:
So, when you're going through your day and you're thinking, “I should do this." What does that thought process look like of your brain saying, "I should be doing all these things," and then how do you answer yourself and say, "Yes, but I'm going to choose something else.”
CHRIS:
My ideal is to have some healthy boundaries, with a set working time.
What I currently do is write down all my tasks for the day and think “which one of these is going to bring me the least amount of stress?”
So right now I'm in a place where Oikos generally kind of runs itself.
So I can't really grow it without effort, but with low stress effort, I can keep the wheels on.
So I'm just letting it grow organically, and then doing tasks that are going to cause me the least amount of stress and just trying not to worry about it.
I'm also at a point where the business makes enough money that I can actually pay some people, or I can kind of make the problem go away with money sometimes.
Takeaway
- Have healthy boundaries around working times.
- Realize when you need a break, and be mindful of your family and their needs.
- Design your time and efforts with real life in mind.
- Remember the impact you want to make on those most important to you, and design your life to support that ultimate goal.
What can you change to help the business take better care of you?
Timestamp: 39:26
CHRIS:
I've been asking my wife, and especially my oldest, telling them that I need their help. This is supposed to be a family business, so I've basically just been asking them for more help.
I need to offload some of the administrative tasks that, once someone's trained, really anybody could do. It's answering emails. It's doing some slight changes and updating inventory on the website.
If I can offload my quadrant one, my important urgent things, that would free me up more to focus on the non-urgent important tasks and those are primarily all oriented on growth.
I do need to get more on top of my books so I can figure out what I can pay people because I want to pay my wife. So, that's what I need to do. I need to get on a budget and I need to hire some of my family members.
Takeaway
- Determine what tasks can be delegated, and make a plan for hiring one or two people you already know.
- Take care of your bookkeeping and get on a budget.
How long do you want to run this business?
Timestamp: 42:06
ABIGAIL:
If you could never retire and run it till you're dead, or you only want to do it for 20 years… What does that look like?
CHRIS:
I don't know that I've honestly thought that far ahead. That's hard. I feel like the season that I'm in until my kids are grown, so maybe somewhere around, for the next 10 to 20 years, because again, for me, one of the biggest reasons was the lifestyle of just being around being a family.
So once they're grown and gone, I don't know that I'll want to continue.
It's kind of hard to say.
I've played around with the idea of franchising, or maybe consulting others who want to start food buyer’s clubs, maybe making a second stream of income that way.
I don't really know. I want to focus on trying to be content.
It's hard for me. I want to be content with what I have and not just see growth for growth's sake.
If it grows that big organically and people come to me looking for advice and it makes financial sense and I feel like I can help them, then let's do it.
But I don't have any kind of “in 5 years I want to be doing this, in 10 years maybe I should do that” sort of plan.
ABIGAIL:
So, it's another situation almost like when you started it. You see this coming up down the road later on and you're like “later I'm going to have to figure out this and this.”
You're just kind of waiting to see what pieces are coming into the puzzle at that time and then you'll make the decision.
Takeaway
- You don’t have to have an “exit strategy” in place from the very beginning. It’s ok to figure it out when all the pieces of the puzzle exist at the same time.
- Seasons change, and you may not be running this business exactly as it is for the rest of your life. Consider what season you’re in right now, and how the business supports your lifestyle goals right now. How will your lifestyle change later, and what sort of business would best support those goals? Start keeping an eye out for opportunities to point the business in that direction.
How do we change our own mental expectation of what this looks like and what we really want?
Timestamp: 47:14
ABIGAIL:
Because I think what we really want is something more self-sustainable, but we just keep getting all this pressure to make it grow and make it bigger and better. How do we fight that all-consuming growth mentality?
CHRIS:
We're getting into some good philosophy.
It is THE question to be asking, I think, for people who are not in this for money. So, if you're in this for money, you're not even having these discussions. But for those of us who are in this for a good life, like I just want to make enough to live, you got to be honest with yourself.
At what point am I going to be content? What is “enough?”
It's hard! You look around and you compare yourself to the Joneses and you see what they have. I do it too.
I have five acres. I'm like “man it'd be nice to have 10, I could do all this with 10” and then I'm like that's twice the amount of work.
So sure, maybe I'd make more money, but it's also twice the amount of work.
I don't really need more money. There's times when money is handy and it's a good tool. It helps me. But for my daily living expenses, I don't need more money.
So, I guess, I don't know.
But the question you're asking is the quest that I've been on.
That’s part of the reason why some would say I’ve been lackadaisical about how I've been running my business lately, and all the things that I should be doing that I'm not doing.
I just read Aldous Huxley's Brave New World. And there's a quote in the beginning where this controller is talking about conditioning this roomful of children, and he says “a love of botany and books doesn't keep factories full.”
I feel like that's what happened in school! There was no love for botany or books, or really the arts, and more and more they're pushing that stuff out.
It's all about being a cog for the machine and can you get your papers done on time. They don't want you to be self- sustainable. They want you to be dependent because you'll spend more money in the economy.
So that has hit me hard lately.
I don’t want a lifestyle that gives me more money so I can have more toys.
I want a lifestyle that gives me more time for botany and books.
Takeaway
- What is most important to you?
If you were a super villain and this was your evil plan, how do you want this work to change the world?
Timestamp: 52:46
How can we best support your mission?
CHRIS:
If I could change the world through what I'm doing, it would be to make it just as easy for people to support their local farms, their local economy, as it is for them to shop industrialized food at the grocery store.
Your health is wealth. You either pay the farmer now or pay the doctor later.
I want to make it more convenient for people to support local, and I would love to see Americans buying more than 50% of their food from local, small-scale farms.
ABIGAIL:
So for people who aren't in Fort Myers, do you have a directory that you could point us to? How can we find other food buyer’s clubs in our area, or find co-ops and farms directly?
CHRIS:
I would say localharvest.org and the raw milk finder. And typically where you find raw milk, you'll find buying clubs and co-ops like this.
So yeah, the best would be to start supporting a local co-op food buying club in your area, or if you feel so inclined to give a donation to Oikos, that'd be a huge blessing. Just contact us through our website for the best way to do that - I don't have a dedicated donations page.
Let's get your finances off the back burner and into a system that actually works.